Early 19th C scordatura

[David Norton]

All,

A question: was Sor the first person to advocate retuning the bass strings (6/D, 6/F, 5/G)? I can't find anything earlier. And I haven't found similar scordaturae in Giuliani, Carulli, Carcassi, or any of the other peers. 

(Okay, caveat: there's that famous Saltarello or Italiana from the Chilesotti book which uses 6/D.  BUT!! While technically this predates Sor by some centuries, it wasn't made generally available until 1890 or so, well past Sor's time and well past any opportunity to influence him.)

TIA 

[Lars Hedelius-Strikkertsen]

Following this link http://musikverket.se/musikochteaterbiblioteket/ladda-ner-noter/boi... will get you to op. 12 by Carcassi. Three themes with variations. The last is with 6th tuned in D. But You're right its its very rare beside the music by Sor

[David Norton]

Thank you for this, Lars. 

[Lars Hedelius-Strikkertsen]

youre welcome :-)

[David Norton]

Lars, how did you happen to know of this piece? do you play it

[Lars Hedelius-Strikkertsen]

sometimes i sit down and look through a lot of music on the web :-) and i just came across it. I have been playing it. Its ok music

[Gabriel Schebor]

And, following this link, Carcassi works tith the guitar tuned in E Major.

http://carkiv.musikverk.se/www/boije/Boije_0090.pdf

[Arthur J. Ness]

That Italiana is a lute piece from about 1603.  There are numerous other similar examples in Fuhrmann's lute book.  It's a bagpipe piece.  The D-A-d ostinato represents the drone and the top  line the chanter melody.  It is NOT by Galilei, but comes from a German manuscript lute book copied in Nuremberg about the same time.  They were written 800 miles apart (Nrnberg to Florence). Respighi used it as a B part in piece in his first orchestral suite, Ancient Airs and Dances, and players are think they belong together.  Galiarda (VG), Italiana (Anon.), Galiarda (da capo). There are a few other pieces in Chilesotti's Codice Lauten-Buch that require the same "Drop D tuning" when played on guitar.  Lute term: Abzug means VI=F.  

[Arthur J. Ness]

A Postscript.  That is Georg Fuhrmann's _**Testudi Gallo-Germanica**_ (Nuremberg 1613) that has several similar bagpipe (Dudelsack) pieces with that D-A-d drone.  Dowland also uses the drone at the beginning of his "Battel Galiard," because the bagpiper led the soldiers into battle. The gagliarda here is Vicenzo Galilei's "Polymnia Gagliarda" from a manuscript in the Central Library in Florence.  It's unusually contrapuntal in style, because Polymnia is the Greek Muse of Sacred Song and Oratory.

[Gabriel Schebor]

See this: http://ks.imslp.net/files/imglnks/usimg/0/0c/IMSLP173310-PMLP306046...

Pedro Ximénez Abrill Tirado (Peru 1784-Bolivia 1856) was a great composer, apart from this wonderful piece. He composed over 300 works for the guitar, and around 40 sinfonies, religious works, 50 masses, songs, piano music, etc.

[Juan Pablo Pira]

Thank you.  Any idea of what this guy means by "Flautas" near the end of the rondo.  It is obvious it is not harmonics.

[Gabriel Schebor]

they are harmonics. This same word is used in 6 course guitar music by Laporta, Ferandiere, and anonymous M.S.

[Juan Pablo Pira]

How do you play a 4 string D chord in harmonics? if it is arpeggiated, how is that different from what you see in the next measures?