Early Guitars and Vihuela

A network for historic guitars and vihuelas

Just a reminder to all of us that this is a site devoted to pre-Torres guitars and the Spanish 16thC vihuela, and that does not included ukuleles, charangos, modern classical guitars, etc, no matter how one might trace the roots of these instruments back to early guitars or vihuelas. There are other ning sites devoted to these instruments.

Please stay on topic, folks.

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An honest question or two. Is the mandolin considered on topic for this site? And more to the point, is the mandore, as a precursor of the mandolin, considered on topic? I'm not trying to raise controversy, but rather avoid it. I can always discuss the mandore on the lute site if that seems more appropriate. Being lazy, I had hoped to focus on just this one...
You are being lazy, Chris. LOL! The mandore has been discussed on the ning lute site, where you will also be able to hear a recording of a mandore recital I did for the BBC. As for the mandolin, that is part of the Cittern ning site - a very good site with some really knowlegeable mandolin people.

It might be a pain having to belong to several groups, but it is not painful...and it does help keep a focus to each group. Believe it or not - shock, horror - there are some people here who are not at all interested in the mandolin or ukulele.

The most controversial point you raised was in saying the mandore is a precursor of the mandolin. But you can discuss that on the mandolin site :-)

Rob
Crikes, Rob... Must you be so nice about this? Aren't moderators supposed to be mean and heavy-handed? Looks like I have to expand a little. (Oh, the pain, the pain of it all.)
You are absolutely correct, and Renaissance guitars are most welcome here. But a uke (and I love them) is not a Renaissance guitar, in the same way that a modern classical guitar is not a vihuela. We don't discuss post-Torres guitars here, nor do we discuss the ukulele. But there other places that do.
There is no evidence that the 4-course guitar was popular in Italy in the 16th century and Brizeno says nothing about his chord system being used with the 4-course guitar. I think you are mixing him up with Joan Carles Amat who does include a chapter in "Guitarra espanola" explaining how the basic guitar chords can be played on a 4-course rather than 5-course guitar. Amat's tuning instructions clearly indicate the use of bourdons on the 4th and 5th courses. One of Millioni's books - printed in about 1635 does explain how alfabeto chords can be played on a 4-course instrument.
Well - I am happy to say that the 4-course guitar almost certainly had a re-entrant tuning in Spain in the 16th century. Mudarra at the beginning of his pieces for 4-course guitar says that it must have a bourdon on the 4th course and 10 frets. This implies that it didn't always have a bourdon on the 4th course or 10 frets, but these are necessary for Mudarra's pieces. I am obsessive when it comes to getting the facts right. There isn't really any clear evidence in Italian sources - but that's a long story. Have a happy Christmas if you are one who celebrates it at all and all the best for the New Year. Monica

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