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Very interesting book I didn't new before, with some scores, and in the second part (f. 48) some tabs for six courses mandora and 5 course guitar. (nice music not too hard to play)

Do you know this book, is it by Logy/Losy ?

Thanks for your answers...


Tags: baroque, guitar

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I can't answer your question, but did you find any indication of how the instruments are tuned? 

I try to play the parts in tabs, it works on a baroque guitar (missing the 6th string for the first part) so standard tuning. I also have some mandora tabs from Wien that works on a six strings guitar standard tuning.

Can this file, as a whole, be downloaded Valèry?


A member did a pdf on the french Delcamp forum (at first Jean-François Delcamp gave the link to the tab.)

I'll ask to post it here.

Here is a pdf (thanks to Francis Privet for doing the job, and to Jean-François Delcamp for the link to the MS...)



Many thanks, Valèry - and to Francis Privet.

Two pieces in the book are using 12 courses (f47v, aria, and the piece f. 90r) Mathias Rösel suggest an Archguitar.

Another person said that the rondeau f 51v is also in Saizenay Ms (and other) with attribution to Losy.


Further to this, at the time I forgot to mention some other digital facsimiles of solo mandora music available for download here:



The Ms A 20.545 is particularly interesting and contains some quite decent pieces. It is for 8 course mandora (probably in the E tuning) which became popular towards the end of the 18th century.  But most pieces can be played on a 'romantic' 6 string guitar (or even a 5 course guitar with low bourdons) with a few octave adjustments. Note the high passage work (fret n on the second course etc) in pieces such as the Polon(aise) on fol 13v-14 and the Rondo on fol 15v-16.




I usually keep a guitar with 6th string replaced by a 5th gauge one tuned to G  for all those Brescianello mandora pieces requiring the same - I think it's much more thrilling with the particular resonance as occurs than if you just use normal guitar tuning and play those G's at 3rd fret instead of it being an open string.

It happen I have a 2nd hand copy of the Musica Antiqua Bohemica edition of Losy guitar works (56 pieces) transcribed into regular music notation for guitar, and very straightforwardly done I think, no 'arranging' for modern guitar going on even though intended for modern guitarists to play with (published 1962)... anyway,

for the 'Loschi' rondeau from this here manuscript (the only piece from this manuscript considered to be by Logy, and placed in the MAB edition) the previous owner has written in - Luta G37: 29; ms Gottingen.

Don't know what that reference be. 

Plus, forgot to mention, the editor's notes to the MAB Losy guitar edition state that this here manuscipt was written out before 1700.

I agree that the pioneering MAB edition was advanced for its day (my copy has the date1979 not 1962 so I presume a silent second edition).

Unfortunately the transcription is not always accurate or straightforward. As examples:  the first Allemande from Prague II Kk 77 (MAB p 1) is transcribed with incorrect note values; the  Aria (MAB p 17) is not in 5/4 time; and the Rondeau from Brno D 189 (MAB p. 31) is for mandora not guitar. I'm also not convinced of the editorial realisation for the ornaments.

Nevertheless, it was a good attempt by Jaroslav Pohanka at the time, and was one of the very few publications in the 1970s making an attempt to uncover original sources and to make the music accessible to a wider audience before the days of digital downloads etc.


No major crimes then - and to be fair, for the rondeau it says 'for guitar or mandora'.

I looked at that  Aria for the first time today, there must be a good reason for the 5/4 . The impression I get is that the edition was very thoroughly researched and prepared - I just looked at the Treder version... same conclusion - 5.

What then be your thoughts on it Martyn?

I rather admire the placing of 5 rather than thinking it impossible to be correct. Shifting off track, I'm minded of Legnani's opus 1, Terremoto con variationi - Variation 4 has lots of notes grouped in 5's (and it's great fun) but 2 modern editions decided they didn't like notes grouped in 5's (pentaplets? ; ) and changed them from groups of 5 demisemiquavers into groups of 4 demisemiquavers + 1 semiquaver (as quasi groups of 6) ... at least the Ut Orpheus edition (otherwise beautifully set) confesses the alteration in the opening notes -

but I digress, and am keen to hear more from you about the Losy aria, specially  as you've given it a lot more thought than have I.



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